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MessagePosté: 17 Déc 2016, 21:04 
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LES FEMMES

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MessagePosté: 17 Déc 2016, 23:02 
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Bon, j'espère qu'au moins elle suce bien ?


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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 00:45 
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Pas pour faire mon chieur "les reshoots ont niqué le film" mais absolument tous les plans coupés ont plus de gueule que le résultat final. C'est quand même balot.

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 00:49 
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Quelques jolis plans ont disparu mais les plus beaux sont dans le film.

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 13:24 
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Pas pour faire mon chieur "les reshoots ont niqué le film"

Pendant ce temps, un mec que je connais sur Facebook et qui est mitigé sur le film affirme que "les reshoots ont été bénéfiques".

Les gens... Post-truth jusqu'au bout.

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 13:55 
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Mais oui stop. Y'a trop de fantasme dans tout ça. Un peu comme les versions longues de BvS et Suicide Squad : "LA VERSION LONGUE QUI CHANGERA TOUT".

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 22:25 
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deudtens a écrit:
Ah, j'ai oublié un dernier truc pas terrible :

La scène avec Krennic qui tient Jyn en joue mais qui se fait en fait semi-buter par le latino qui est pas mort en fait, c'est ZZZzzzzZZZzzzz. Paresseux, cliché, pauvre. Ca sent le reshoot baclé.


Et dans la foulée
le latino qui s'avance pour s'assurer qu'il est bien mort et la fille qui le retient genre "laisse, c'est bon, il a eu son compte, viens, on va baiser", histoire que tout le monde soit bien sûr qu'il va se relever dix secondes plus tard.


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boultan a écrit:
deudtens a écrit:
Ah, j'ai oublié un dernier truc pas terrible :

La scène avec Krennic qui tient Jyn en joue mais qui se fait en fait semi-buter par le latino qui est pas mort en fait, c'est ZZZzzzzZZZzzzz. Paresseux, cliché, pauvre. Ca sent le reshoot baclé.


Et dans la foulée
le latino qui s'avance pour s'assurer qu'il est bien mort et la fille qui le retient genre "laisse, c'est bon, il a eu son compte, viens, on va baiser", histoire que tout le monde soit bien sûr qu'il va se relever dix secondes plus tard.

Sauf que...c'est l'inverse.

Et pour le coup, c'est pas utilisé comme ficelle pas crédible pour qu'il les rechoppe mais pour avoir cette image superbe du mec qui ne se relève que pour voir sa propre arme s'ériger devant lui et l'annihiler.

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 23:14 
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Sinon truc génial:
Vador dans son bacta tank comme le sera plus tard son fils au début de l'Episode V.
Petit parallélisme digne des préquelles de Lucas.

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deudtens a écrit:
Ah putain j'ai oublié de parler d'un truc:

c'est moi ou ya un running gag sur les dialogues de stormtroopers ? Ya quasiment le même dialogue sur un truc technique (droïde ptet) obsolète que dans l'épisode 7.

Oui, c'était déjà une réf à un dialogue du IV.

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MessagePosté: 18 Déc 2016, 23:54 
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Moi, j'aimerais qu'on me confirme qu'il y a incohérence ou pas conçernant la création de l'Étoile Noire. Si je me souviens bien, à la fin de Attack of the Clones, les Geonesiens donnent les plans de l'Étoile Noire à Count Dooku pour qu'il les remettent à l'Empereur. J'ai toujours cru que les Geonesiens étaient les véritables ingénieurs de cette arme. À la fin de Revenge of the Sith, l'Empereur et Darth Vador admirent au loin l'Étoile Noire en construction. À ce stade, ce serait donc une simple base spatiale? Je trouve ça peu crédible que les Geonesiens n'inventent pas la puissante arme en son centre et que Galen Erso soient convoqué des décennies après pour en inventer l'arme surpuissante qui la compose. Où est l'intérêt de bâtir l'Étoile à la fin de Revenge of the Sith si l'arme n'est pas encore inventé?

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MessagePosté: 19 Déc 2016, 00:45 
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Bon, j'ai trouvé réponse sur Star Wars Wiki.

Pourquoi faire simple quand on peut faire compliqué. Si ça intéresse quelqu'un, attention:

Origins

"«The Jedi must not find our designs for the Ultimate Weapon. If they find out what we are planning to build, we're doomed.»"
"I will take the designs with me to Coruscant. They will be much safer there…with my Master."
―Poggle the Lesser and Count Dooku[src]

Plans for a moon-shaped battle station were first developed by the weaponsmiths of Geonosis for use by two malevolent Sith Lords, Darth Sidious and Darth Tyranus, in the waning decades of the Galactic Republic.[1] The massive project was funded for by a conglomerate of factions, including the Trade Federation, Muunilist Banking Clan, the Techno Union, and covertly, the Republic itself.[9] During later Republic interrogation, Geonosian leader Poggle the Lesser would claim that the schematics were merely presented to them by Dooku, and that the Geonosians had simply refined them. Furthermore, he would admit that the Stalgasin hive hadn't had time to design the station's main weapon before the Battle of Geonosis interrupted development.[2] Its design, centered around a superlaser array using massive kyber crystals, was inspired by technology developed by the ancient Sith.[21]

Ten years after the Invasion of Naboo, Tyranus was at the head of the Confederacy of Independent Systems, a secessionist movement on the brink of the war with the Republic. That year, the Republic ended up sending its newly-acquired army of clone troopers to Geonosis, which started the Clone Wars. The conflict had in fact been provoked by Sidious, who secretly manipulated both sides: he himself led the Republic under his public persona of Supreme Chancellor Palpatine, while his acolyte Tyranus led the Confederacy as Count Dooku. With the invasion of Geonosis by the clones, Geonosian leader Poggle the Lesser turned the designs of their "Ultimate Weapon" over to Dooku for safekeeping, not knowing of the man's alter ego and ties with Sidious.[1]
By 21 BBY, the Republic Special Weapons Group developed plans for both an automated battlemoon asteroid, along with plans for a torpedo siege platform, none of which made it past the design stage.[2]
Those privy to top-secret intel concluded that the plans for the Death Star must have fallen into Republic hands during or shortly after the Second Battle of Geonosis in 21 BBY, with Supreme Chancellor Palpatine presenting the plans to the Republic Strategic Advisory Cell shortly after the battle in the cell's second briefing. The Strategic Advisory Cell planned the construction of the Death Star, and regularly met at the summit of the Strategic Planning Amphitheater of the Republic Center for Military Operations on Coruscant. There, a mixed-species gathering of 150 beings from prestigious and influential positions met to discuss progress on the battle station. The meetings included members from but not limited to; select senators, representatives from Corellian Engineering, Kuat Drive Yards, and Rendili StarDrive, key advisers, the chief of naval intelligence, the director of COMPOR, high-ranking members of the military, members of the War Production Board, structural engineers, starship designers, theoretical and experimental physicists, Dr. Gubacher, Prof. Sahali, Lieutenant Commander Orson Krennic, Vice Chancellor Mas Amedda, and Supreme Chancellor Palpatine himself. The Jedi were not invited to the meetings, nor did they even know about the project under construction over Geonosis.[2]
All members involved in the construction of the battle station were required to sign the Official Secrets Act. Near unlimited funding was provided to the project owing to Republic fears that the Separatists had their own battle station under construction, which intelligence surmised was the reason Count Dooku failed to attack the station over Geonosis. Geonosian Leader Poggle the Lesser maintained his position that the Separatists had no project of their own in the works. Despite this, most cell members refused to take Poggle at his word, and scoured the galaxy to locate the presumed construction site. While the evidence was specious, rejecting the possibility would have jeopardized Republic funding for the project, regardless of the authority ceded to Supreme Chancellor Palpatine by the Emergency Powers Act. Thus, Republic effort into constructing the battle station was viewed as a priority in order to beat the Separatists at their supposed own.[2]

Funding for the project would have been viewed as spurious before the Clone Wars, however as the war dragged on more and more research firms were dragged into government contracts focusing on a different aspect of the space station, such as in shielding or power supply, and all unaware of what their research was ultimately for. Researchers involved in defense projects were required to sign the Official Secrets Oath.[2]

Initial construction on the Death Star had been carried out by newly designed machines, some of which were controlled by sentient operators stationed in orbital command habitats. A vast array of ships provided the station with metals, organic materials, and supplies of water. Viable asteroids were towed and tractor-beamed to the station from both around the planet and from fields surrounding the Geonosis system. Once mined, ores were sent to foundries in synchronous orbit for the production of durasteel and other metals. Cannibalized droid factories built by Baktoid Armor on Geonosis's surface allowed additional foundries to go online soon after the start of asteroid mining.[2]

In 21 BBY, after the Second Battle of Geonosis and before the first anniversary of the First Battle of Geonosis, the Strategic Advisory Cell announced the completion of phase one of the Death Star's construction. The supports for the station's one hundred and twenty kilometers from pole to pole had been completed. The next phase of construction revolved around the fabrication of a temporary equator, along with a series of longitudinal bands to rough in the sphere. As the bands were secured, construction of the hull commenced, along with the partitioning of individual interior sections. The cabinspaces were to be clad, sealed, and pressured in order to permit the use of sentient laborers in addition to droids.[2]

Initial labor estimates revolved in the millions. A Strategic Advisory Cell subcommittee considered providing the Kaminoans with a template to grow a labor force of clones adapted for deep-space work. Orson Krennic independently negotiated a deal with Poggle the Lesser; in return for his cooperation with the Republic, he would have his Geonosian workers begin construction on the facility. Instead of being punished, Krennic was given greater oversight over the project by Mas Amedda. After several months, workers had completed the station's false equator, with what Krennic described as looking like "an antique gyroscope" rather than an actual sphere. Following this acheivement, several degrees of the upper hemisphere had been outfitted with latitudinal structural members, and rudimentary layout work had begun on cladding a portion of the curved hull. Construction droids devoted themselves to fashioning the first interior spaces meant to serve as placeholders until actual cabinspaces could be bullheaded. The Geonosians were the first organics planned to inhabit the life-support modules. In the wake of Poggle's previous announcement of the project to the Geonosians, tens of thousands of drones had been transferred to Orbital Foundry 7, the second largest structure in view from the command habitat. The drones oversaw the construction of enormous pie-slice-shaped concavities that, when assembled, would form the battle station's focusing dish and power well. By this time, three slices had been completed, and another six were in various stages of completion. The drone laborers were overseen by winged soldiers, loyal to castes overseen by Poggle, who had a lavish suite linked by a series of tubular connectors to the foundry.[2]

The plan for assembling the station's dish called for assembling it in space and maneuvering it by tug and tractor beam into a gargantuan well that had been framed into the sphere's upper hemisphere—the dimple, as some referred it. The parabolic dish was engineered to telescope away from the hull to facilitate the aiming of the early composite beam proton superlaser design some of the Special Weapons Group scientists had proposed. Owing to the fact that design on the actual weapon had been incomplete by the time construction had started, most individuals involved in the project held the notion that function would have to follow form. Orson Krennic was placed in charge of the construction, assembly, and installation of the dish.[2]

As a result of his cooperation, Poggle was allowed a ship to travel between Geonosis and the station. Poggle's production philosophy revolved around forcing the drones to perform work that was beneath their skill or caste level as a means of increasing their final output. As a result, the drones were unhappy with their situation. Weeks later, the last of the pie-slice dish modules had been fabricated, however the dish itself was not fully assembled and the upper hemishpere still undergoing finishing touches. Droid work fashioning cabinspaces in the pole region had proceeded slower than expected. During this time, Geonosians began dying off en masse owing to the fact that they lacked work—a unique psyiological trait of the Geonosian species. Poggle insisted that this provided competition and adequate motivation for the laborers to work harder. Marines were required to exterminate workers that refused to follow orders. By 19 BBY, the Geonosian labor force engaged in a full-scale riot, destroying three months worth of work in the process. During this time, the battle station's parabolic focusing dish was nearing assembly, hull cladding had been added, and interior spaces had been bulkheaded and made habitable. Living conditions for the drones had been improved, and every attempt made to limit overcrowding. In reality, the riot was a diversion to allow Archduke Poggle the Lesser to escape aboard his small craft, which had a hyperdrive secretly installed by his drones.[2]

Kyber crystals were scoured from across the galaxy in order to construct the station, with the Separatist Alliance doing so near the end of the Clone Wars. One such attempt would end in failure on the Outer Rim world of Utapau after interdiction by Jedi Master Obi-Wan Kenobi and Jedi Knight Anakin Skywalker.[22]

In 19 BBY, the three-year Clone Wars came to an end. As the war ended, Darth Sidious got rid of his Confederacy puppets, including his own apprentice, and proclaimed the birth of a new, authoritarian Galactic Empire, anointing himself Emperor.
Imperial EraEdit
"Wilhuff, are the rumors true?"
"What rumors? And why are you whispering?"
"About a mobile battle station. A weapon that will—"
"This is hardly the place for discussions of that sort."
―Nils Tenant confides with Wilhuff Tarkin outside the Imperial Palace[src]

For years during the station's construction, numerous skirmishes with Imperial shipping managed to delay construction. When a band of Lothal rebels managed to attack and destroy an Imperial supply convoy carrying kyber crystals five years before the Battle of Yavin, construction on the station was hampered.[28] At some point after these attacks, the station was moved from Geonosis to another base, and in order to keep the project a secret, the entire Geonosian species was wiped out. Three years before the Battle of Yavin, one of the modules used during construction was used by ISB Agent Kallus to ambush the same group of rebels previously responsible for ambushing the supply convoy of kyber crystals, who this time were on a mission to find out what the Empire was building above the planet. The Empire's attempt to capture the rebels ultimately failed.[26] At some point in the station's construction, it was moved from Geonosis to Scarif,[17] where Director Orson Krennic would oversee the protection of the station with the aid of his personal detachment of Death Troopers.[18]

Completion and demonstration

"This station is now the ultimate power in the universe."
―Admiral Conan Antonio Motti[src]

Having taken much longer than expected to develop,[29] the massive construction project was finally completed almost twenty years after its conception during the Clone Wars,[13] and at some point was rechristened as the Death Star. Imperial Navy pilots and military personnel were eventually assigned to the station shortly before it was revealed to the public, being new enough to still be labeled as classified.[8] Soon after, the Alliance to Restore the Republic intercepted a coded transmission from scientist Galen Erso, indicating that a major weapons test was imminent, prompting them to assign a group of Rebels to steal what they would discover to be the plans to the Death Star.[30] With the mission a success, the Rebel agents transmitted the technical readouts of the battle station to Imperial senator and rebel sympathizer, Princess Leia Organa of Alderaan, who intended to pass them along to her allies. However, before she could do so, the blockade runner she was aboard was intercepted by Imperial forces commanded by Darth Vader, and she was captured, but not before she could pass the plans over to the astromech droid R2-D2, and send him in an escape pod down to the planet below.[7]

As a high-value prisoner, Organa was moved to Cell 2187 of Detention Block AA-23, sub-level five,[9] where she was interrogated in order to learn the location of the Rebellion's secret base. Faced with her considerable resistance to Imperial interrogation techniques, Tarkin opted to try a different approach: intimidation. In a move calculated to force Organa to reveal the Rebel base, Tarkin threatened to use the station's primary weapon to destroy her homeworld. Though she ostensibly relented and supplied the rebel base's location as being on Dantooine, Tarkin ordered the attack to move forward in order to demonstrate the military power that the Empire now held. In a matter of moments, the Death Star destroyed the planet Alderaan, leaving no survivors.[7]

Immediately after the planet's destruction, the Star Destroyer Devastator left the station and a small Imperial force was sent to investigate Leia's claim under the command of General Cassio Tagge.[31] Upon arrival in the system however, it was discovered that the base was abandoned.[8] Angered by Leia's lie, Vader and Tarkin conspired to allow Organa to be rescued by a group of outlaws, in order to follow them back to the Rebel base themselves.[7]

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MessagePosté: 19 Déc 2016, 02:23 
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Erik Vonk a écrit:
Moi, j'aimerais qu'on me confirme qu'il y a incohérence ou pas conçernant la création de l'Étoile Noire. Si je me souviens bien, à la fin de Attack of the Clones, les Geonesiens donnent les plans de l'Étoile Noire à Count Dooku pour qu'il les remettent à l'Empereur. J'ai toujours cru que les Geonesiens étaient les véritables ingénieurs de cette arme. À la fin de Revenge of the Sith, l'Empereur et Darth Vador admirent au loin l'Étoile Noire en construction. À ce stade, ce serait donc une simple base spatiale? Je trouve ça peu crédible que les Geonesiens n'inventent pas la puissante arme en son centre et que Galen Erso soient convoqué des décennies après pour en inventer l'arme surpuissante qui la compose. Où est l'intérêt de bâtir l'Étoile à la fin de Revenge of the Sith si l'arme n'est pas encore inventé?

Hein ?
C'est juste des plans, encore faut-il réussir à les concrétiser. Le mec.
PS : Star Wars wiki, non merci.

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MessagePosté: 19 Déc 2016, 02:52 
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Massinfect a écrit:
Hein ?
C'est juste des plans, encore faut-il réussir à les concrétiser. Le mec.


C'est pas juste des plans. C'est les plans de l'Étoile Noire mec. C'est un engin destructeur, alors forcément que l'arme doit faire partie des plans.

Avant que le film Rogue One existe, tout le monde a compris que les Geonesiens avaient créé les plans de l'Étoile Noire et logiquement de l'arme surpuissante en son centre. Mais Rogue One vient un peu contredire la chose, et donc ma question était légitime.

Pour résumer wiki, les Geonesiens n'avaient pas terminé les plans quand la guerre des clones a éclaté, et à la fin de Attack of the Clones, ils les donnent à Dooku pour les sécuriser. Forcément, lorsque Revenge of the Sith se termine, Galen Erso a déjà repris le flambeau et participé à la fin de l'élaboration de la Death Star. C'est donc cohérent. Je trouve simplement un peu dommage que l'on soit obligé d'ouvrir Star Wars wiki pour boucher les trous du scénario. Au départ, j'ai cru que Rogue One niait l’existence des prequels et des Geonesiens avant que l'on voit la planète Mustaphar.

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Mais ça contredit quoi RO ? C'est une arme depuis le début, c'est juste qu'il faut les bons cerveaux pour la créer à partir des plans. Il faut aussi la matière première à raffiner, etc... Le chantier prend du temps, ça énerve Vador et l'Empereur d'ailleurs.

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